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PoBoyR6

Chillout Systems

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Anyone have experience with the chillout system?  www.chilloutsystems.com

Specifically compressor & electrical reliability, glycol consumption, general cooling performance, etc.

Thanks!

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Better bring a beefy alternator and a car with enough torque that it doesn't care about the alternator drawing several HP.

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I do not have personal experience with it - one of my friends / competitors does though - he's been working with the manufacturer to help improve it. We run GT2 / TA2 tube frame cars - they get REALLLLLLLY hot, think NASCAR.....that said - the hotter it is inside the car the more you have to cool that unit as well....you probably want to wire it direct as well. I'm letting my buddy de-bug it and then once it's all good and ready I'll probably buy one. Now, if you are running a production car you may be A-OK with it. I'm not knocking the product - just sharing what I know when it is used in a very extreme environment....my buddy's unit started smoking on the way to the grid at this past weekend's Trans Am race...not sure if it was a wiring issue, user / install error, etc.....

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18 hours ago, Matt93SE said:

Better bring a beefy alternator and a car with enough torque that it doesn't care about the alternator drawing several HP.

What are you basing several HP loss on? My napkin calcs show less than 1 HP draw worst case and that is with very conservative 50% efficiency losses...in reality I think the draw should be closer to 1/2 HP under most conditions.

17 hours ago, Captain Buddha said:

I do not have personal experience with it - one of my friends / competitors does though - he's been working with the manufacturer to help improve it. We run GT2 / TA2 tube frame cars - they get REALLLLLLLY hot, think NASCAR.....that said - the hotter it is inside the car the more you have to cool that unit as well....you probably want to wire it direct as well. I'm letting my buddy de-bug it and then once it's all good and ready I'll probably buy one. Now, if you are running a production car you may be A-OK with it. I'm not knocking the product - just sharing what I know when it is used in a very extreme environment....my buddy's unit started smoking on the way to the grid at this past weekend's Trans Am race...not sure if it was a wiring issue, user / install error, etc.....

Thanks for the info...how hot does it get in those NASCARs...130-140F-ish? I would think you'd want to put a fresh air feed to the unit in addition to mounting it with an air gap to the floor board in extreme cases like those but it might still get toasty if sat on the grid too long in southern summer climes. In this case it would be for a touring bike application so convection cooling won't be much of a concern. Let me know how it goes when you get your system running. 

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2 hours ago, PoBoyR6 said:

What are you basing several HP loss on? My napkin calcs show less than 1 HP draw worst case and that is with very conservative 50% efficiency losses...in reality I think the draw should be closer to 1/2 HP under most conditions.

I'm basing those comments from people that have installed them in smaller low power cars like Spec Miata, with multiple drivers stating they have removed the system because it put such a load on the alternator that the car would barely run at idle and was noticeably down on power while racing.

This thing pulls a fair amount of current (roughly 30A), and more as the temps go up.   you definitely must duct fresh air to them in closed/hot cockpits as their power use is a function of temp difference between each end of the cooler.  i.e. hot air into its heat exchanger (whatever type it uses)= more power consumption..  so if you direct cooler air through a window duct, you will use less juice.

In a car such as a Miata which only has a 60A alternator, a 30A draw from a single device is rough on total capacity.  add in ECU, ignition, fuel pump as major loads, and you have a system that's running at max capacity all the time..   which is a recipe for constant alternator failure.

Now if you're in a larger car like a vette or a midsize japanese V6 car with >200hp and a >100A alternator?   noooo problemo.

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Come on. Let's use real numbers and not gut feelings or anecdotes about other peoples anecdotes. 

A car alternator is about 50% efficient (usually a little higher, but this makes for a nice number to work with.) With a 30A continuous draw at 13.0V, you're looking at a power draw of 390 W.  Since the alternator is 50% efficient, you're looking at 0.78 kW of mechanical power to run the 30A cooler, which is 1.05 horsepower.

So yeah, running a Chillout Systems cooler at full blast costs about one horsepower. In Spec Miata that's a huge hit for sure, and a 1 horse draw with no idle speed compensation will cause idle issues.

The other stuff about total alternator capacity and being "rough" on it and such is BS. An NA Miata from the factory has some big  continuous loads like the heater blower, defroster grid, headlights, Bose stereo and so on. Running a 30A load for the chiller with the other base race car functions isn't going to "max out" the OEM alternator.

So really it comes down to what it's worth to you. I know it's appealing to me to never worry about filling the cool shirt cooler, or rationing my ice, and if we go the endurance route it's a no-brainer! No more bailing water and adding ice during pit stops, no managing the ice during a 2 hour stint. 

For sprint racing low horsepower cars? It's probably not worth the performance ding and the cost of equipment.

 

 

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I know at least one stock power 1.6L Miata H2R challenge car runs one.  He doesn't have any of the issues noted, as expected.  

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Note 1HP loss is a worst worst case...my calcs were based on peak draw of 25A and normal draw of 18-22A as per the site specs. If an adventure touring bike can handle a 30A accessory draw a Miata (or any car made in the last half century) should handle it no probs.

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*shrug*  Just repeating the drivel I'm reading elsewhere on the interwebs from places like Spec Miata forums and other racing related sites.  Do your own research, come to your own conclusions.

Yes I are engineer as well and use rational thought processes.  However, there are many other factors that go into this just beyond max alternator output.  what's the service life of a 60A 1.6 Miata alternator when driven at >80% load under race conditions?  you can likely measure the equipment lifespan in hours or days instead of years.

but again, do your own research, draw your own conclusions, put whatever you want in your car.  Good luck at the track. :)

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15 hours ago, PoBoyR6 said:

Thanks for the info...how hot does it get in those NASCARs...130-140F-ish? I would think you'd want to put a fresh air feed to the unit in addition to mounting it with an air gap to the floor board in extreme cases like those but it might still get toasty if sat on the grid too long in southern summer climes. In this case it would be for a touring bike application so convection cooling won't be much of a concern. Let me know how it goes when you get your system running. 

Of course. More like 140-150++ Yes to everything you’ve said. 

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I have one waiting to go into my M3 as part of the current build.  Please note that everything I'm about to say has come from them - and they have been very up front about the issues that have come up.  They have been very stand up and done a very acceptable job on the customer service side.  The original cooler that went out apparently used too small a gauge wire on the power - causing some units to get hot.  Sounds like some of these were secured directly to the floor board and catching that heat too.  At first they were going to replace the cords - but they ended up replacing the entire unit & sent you a shipping label to return the original one.  The owner actually called while this was happening and explained what they were seeing.  Also suggested to maybe leave a gap between the floor and the bottom of the cooler.  He also gave me a nice discount on any of their cool shirts which was certainly appreciated but not necessary.  Down side on this is that it has been a couple of months since I ordered it & haven't seen the shirt yet.  He did mention that were looking at changing up the shirts a bit - might be the reason for the delay but I'm not sure.  Since I don't need it anytime soon I haven't pressed them on it - will give it some time.  

All in all the theory sounds great but not sure about the execution yet.  I haven't talked with anyone running the 2nd gen version.  As an early adopter of their system I honestly figured there was a decent chance of issues at the beginning - a lot going on with this system.  For me it was worth taking the chance since I knew I had quite a bit of time before I would need it.  I have been very impressed with their customer service  - in my opinion they have been great about communicating and attempting to fix the issues.  Now if the fixes worked - that I don't know yet.

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5 minutes ago, jktx said:

I have one waiting to go into my M3 as part of the current build.  Please note that everything I'm about to say has come from them - and they have been very up front about the issues that have come up.  They have been very stand up and done a very acceptable job on the customer service side.  The original cooler that went out apparently used too small a gauge wire on the power - causing some units to get hot.  Sounds like some of these were secured directly to the floor board and catching that heat too.  At first they were going to replace the cords - but they ended up replacing the entire unit & sent you a shipping label to return the original one.  The owner actually called while this was happening and explained what they were seeing.  Also suggested to maybe leave a gap between the floor and the bottom of the cooler.  He also gave me a nice discount on any of their cool shirts which was certainly appreciated but not necessary.  Down side on this is that it has been a couple of months since I ordered it & haven't seen the shirt yet.  He did mention that were looking at changing up the shirts a bit - might be the reason for the delay but I'm not sure.  Since I don't need it anytime soon I haven't pressed them on it - will give it some time.  

All in all the theory sounds great but not sure about the execution yet.  I haven't talked with anyone running the 2nd gen version.  As an early adopter of their system I honestly figured there was a decent chance of issues at the beginning - a lot going on with this system.  For me it was worth taking the chance since I knew I had quite a bit of time before I would need it.  I have been very impressed with their customer service  - in my opinion they have been great about communicating and attempting to fix the issues.  Now if the fixes worked - that I don't know yet.

Thanks for the info! These things seem really ideal for what we do; I'm super interested to see how they evolve (and if the price comes down!!)

Do you know if their own shirt is much different than Momo, FAST or CoolShirt? It seems like you could just grab one of those and run the cooler...

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18 minutes ago, Shuka said:

Thanks for the info! These things seem really ideal for what we do; I'm super interested to see how they evolve (and if the price comes down!!)

Do you know if their own shirt is much different than Momo, FAST or CoolShirt? It seems like you could just grab one of those and run the cooler...

Exactly my thought - really does look ideal.  The hefty pre-order discount is why I jumped in early - would definitely want to be 100% sure about it at the current price.  My understanding is you can use the other shirts with it as well.  I'm assuming that is what people that are currently using it are doing - but that would assume that the shirt issue is not just limited to my order.

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