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Solo_S14

Comments on NA Alignment Setup / Tire Wear?

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Just now, tyhackman15 said:

Speaking of Penskes, have you heard any reviews on them from H2R members?  Curious as to how they handle the rougher track.  I'm considering upgrading my revalved billies and really only drive out there. 

Can't speak to H2R specifically but they've changed the game in SM at all tracks so I don't see why it wouldn't be a remarkable improvement there. Places where once you did everything to avoid rumbles and bumpers are now welcome (like bus stop chicane at watkins)...problems areas at the regional club tracks are gone on them..so I would think it would handle H2R equally as well. Last time I was out there was many many years ago so I have no clue what it's like now..

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Last time I drove H2R was on crappy koni sports. SM Penske would be a marked improvement as long as you stay out of the bump stops.

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Well I decided to order some 5X racing coilover sleeves to fit the higher spring rates onto the car.  I tried to contact them via email, voicemail, and even through their FB page to ask a couple questions about dimensions, and surprisingly they didn’t respond to any of the notes over a couple of weeks.

So, for anyone interested, their sleeves “swallow” or contain the c-clip by about 18mm.  Then, the thickness of their spring perch is about 14mm.  So with reference to the c-clip as height “zero”, the new spring perch is at (-4mm) i.e. below the c-clip at the lowest “reasonable” setting - bottom of the perch level with the bottom of the sleeve.

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For reference, the eBay / unknown sleeves that were on there didn’t have threads start until about 16mm above the c-clip.  Then their dual collars were about 16mm thick combined, so the spring perch was net +32mm vs the c-clip (or 36mm higher than the 5x racing lowest spring setting).

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After fitting the suspension up, the rear pinch weld (at lowest possible 5x racing setting) was exactly the same as the original “ebay setup” @ 4 3/4”.

The front pinch welds dropped about 1/2” from 4 13/16” to 4 5/16”.  I think I’ll raise the front by ~3/16” to a 4 1/2” pinch weld height, and run 0.25” rake on the car.

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Roughest math in the world - but if the Miata weighs in at ~2,200 lbs, and in a perfect world that means ~600# over each front wheel and ~500# over each rear wheel.  If ALL of the weight were to shift to one side of the car (when you balance it on 2-wheels Saudi-style around Sugar & Spice), the 500# in the rear will compress the rear 500# spring by 1”, and the 600# in the front will compress the 800# spring in the front by 0.75”.....and your pinch welds will be level at 3.75”.  The dumb comparison is really to say that if I run 0.25” rake static, then I’ll always have something between 0.25” and maybe 0.125” dynamically, which I believe is “recommended” as a rake setting.  We’ll see how that works as a starting point when I throw the variables of the splitter and the wing and stuff at it, and see how it responds 👍

 

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5 hours ago, Solo_S14 said:

Roughest math in the world - but if the Miata weighs in at ~2,200 lbs, and in a perfect world that means ~600# over each front wheel and ~500# over each rear wheel.  If ALL of the weight were to shift to one side of the car (when you balance it on 2-wheels Saudi-style around Sugar & Spice), the 500# in the rear will compress the rear 500# spring by 1”, and the 600# in the front will compress the 800# spring in the front by 0.75”.....and your pinch welds will be level at 3.75”.  The dumb comparison is really to say that if I run 0.25” rake static, then I’ll always have something between 0.25” and maybe 0.125” dynamically, which I believe is “recommended” as a rake setting.  We’ll see how that works as a starting point when I throw the variables of the splitter and the wing and stuff at it, and see how it responds 👍

 

Whoa...it's not a 1:1 ratio on the spring here.  Don't even open up that can of worms.  Just use spring rates and ride heights that the big names (aka 949racing) recommend.  Trust me. 

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Take two columns.  In one column, put the cost of XIDAs.  In the other, keep a running tab of all the garbage you're buying.  At some point, you'll become depressed.

It's all about roll stiffness.  Part of that is stiffer springs with matched dampers.  The other part is to add roll bar.  Use the ELBJs.  Also, don't use so much front camber that you kill your braking.  3.5 degrees seems like a nice compromise.  Run about 0.5 degrees less on the rear to balance the car with the front stiffness.

Even with identical setups, some tires just don't hack it.  I get wonderfully even wear out of Toyo RR's.  I kill Maxxis RC-1's quickly.  For me, the RRs are far more economical despite initially higher cost.  They just last way longer.  I don't use RC-1's anymore.

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Meh, you’re not wrong.  I’ve only spent around $300 on springs and sleeves that are arguably recyclable on other setups, and I’ll get to compare / “feel” an over-sprung stiffer setup vs the original “eBay garbage” that came on the car, and see if it’s faster.  To me, there’s some value in playing around with that stuff.  Make a big change, learn from it, etc.

Arguably I could also put Xida’s in one column, and the value of the whole car in the other, and get myself depressed that way 😂.

Casually looking out for a better Miata that I’ll want to keep and develop properly.  I can justify driving crappy suspension (I’ve been doing it all year already) and call it “saving” $1.5-2k to go against a better car that may even have xida’s or whatever.  Then in the meantime I’ll keep posting my crap up here for anyone else that is just getting into this and can learn from it.

Interesting on the RC-1’s.  When I think RC-1’s and Xida’s, I think SuperMiata, and all of the good things they post about them as their title sponsor 😂.  But I guess like you said it’s down to setup, driving style, etc.  I’ve bought some wider wheels, and pairing that with some other tire options might help my situation, will continue to play around with it and see what happens.

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8 hours ago, Hollywood said:

I mean. I’ve got a dope NC for sale. Make a whole new column 😂

 

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My wife has never met you, but she does hate your for sale thread 🙂

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It’s pretty shiny, and color matched to the other NB “you bought for her”.  Seems logical to me...

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1 hour ago, Solo_S14 said:

It’s pretty shiny, and color matched to the other NB “you bought for her”.  Seems logical to me...

Some say it is the fastest color.

 

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